Click here for ICTPA 2019 San Jose conference 

​​International Chinese Transportation Professionals Association

ICTPA

 

 Autonomous Vehicle Technology in China

Sun, 6/7/2020

Jimmy Lin        Hi, Gentlemen, and ladies, I am very pleased to have the opportunity to hook up with you all again.  Peter, I last saw you in Houston and you were leaving for New Orleans afterward, god, it was 4 years ago?

As far as AV is concerned, it is a perpetual topic.  I remember attending a seminar a few years back hosted by MIT’s AV team director, he was very candid about the purpose and the future for AV.  Think about it, aside from maybe the benefit of safety enhancement, there are no other benefit.  Traffic congestion could be worsen because of more capacity with less headway.  We are not going to totally eliminate the drivers therefore there will always be mix flow which will screw up the platoon. I just bought a Maserati, do you think I want it to drive by itself, hell no. AV depends highly on external technology and infrastructure which can go bad spontaneously.  I believe the best application for AV is to run a routine transit route in a confined compound like college campus of sort that it can operate continuously until it runs out of juice.  My point is, let’s pick a more interesting topic.  AV is pretty stale right now!

Joel       

Totally agree with Jimmy. However, my government is going to invest a lot of money in this industry. I have no way to stop them, so probably it's a good idea to organize a forum and put all the pros and cons on the table.

JamesC 焦國安

該特斯拉在快要到達揮手人的位置開始有白煙冒出。也許要問車輛事故專家,在該車的當時速度下,要煞車多久才會有白煙冒出?不知當時特斯拉的自動輔助駕駛系統市府開啟?https://udn.com/news/story/7320/4606009

特斯拉黃姓駕駛則向警方供稱,他確實有開啟車輛輔助系統,當時車速也維持約110公里左右,本以為車子的煞車系統會偵測到障礙物而啟動,後發現車子仍定速前進,他反應過來後即馬上踩煞車,但已無足夠時間及距離閃避貨車,才會直直撞上貨車廂。”

以下是特斯拉官網的性能介紹:

駕駛輔助功能
8 部攝影鏡頭和 12 部超音波感測器可以偵測車道標記和周圍物體 — 隨時提供 360 度的環繞視野。

駕駛輔助功能
所有新款 Tesla 車輛均標配最進階的駕駛輔助功能,旨在提供增強的安全性和便利性,為駕駛員帶來輕鬆愉快的駕駛體驗。

展望未來的 Autopilot 自動輔助駕駛
所有 Tesla 車輛都具備未來在幾乎所有情況下全自動駕駛所需的硬體,我們相信未來的全自動駕駛安全程度將是一般人類駕駛的兩倍。

自動變換車道
在高速公路上駕駛時自動變換車道

全自動駕駛硬體配備
每輛全新 Model S 皆標配先進的硬體配備,提供滿足現有 Autopilot 自動輔助駕駛需求的配備,以及未來透過軟件更新不斷完善功能的全自動駕駛。

很顕然這個功能介紹使用了Autopilot (自動駕駛)字眼,雖然中文翻譯加了輔助兩個字,確不能掩蓋英文的本意。
他們也強調「所有 Tesla 車輛都具備未來在幾乎所有情況下全自動駕駛所需的硬體,我們相信未來的全自動駕駛安全程度將是一般人類駕駛的兩倍。 」以及「在高速公路上駕駛時自動變換車道」。顕然是誤導駕駛人。
因為特斯拉雷達特性的關係,雷達設定把靜止物件濾除了(避免被路側的分割島、公車站等等干擾)。靜止物件是無法辨識的。因此,至於影像應該是認不出來那個橫躺的貨車。
所以,交通部應該考慮管制類似宣稱autopilot車輛的文宣,以及在台灣道路上,除了特別許可的測試車輛,相關自駕功能應該關避,以免誤導駕駛錯誤認知。

Joel       

I should add one more for footnote. The industry we are focusing on is not autonomous vehicle manufacturing, but ICT related devices and solutions. For instance, artificial intelligence, Lidar, digital maps, and sensors.

JamesC 焦國安

This accident was on the news a few days ago in TAIWAN.            
Jimmy’s point is week taken particularly in Taiwan considering the mixed traffic with motorcycles whose driving behaviors are not something that AV will be able to detect and react properly.

Joel       

If the promotion of autonomous vehicle is not simply for solving the problems of transportation, it might be a stimulus for future growth of ICT industry in Taiwan.

陳瑞麟 Reh-Lin N. Chen

I am glad to see Jimmy, James and Joel’s discussions.  James’ recent collision example matched what I learned from the 10/02/2019 World Safety Summit On Autonomous Technology in San Jose area.  Sensors and speed controls are two of ongoing top priorities of Autonomous Vehicles’ developing technology that has a plenty of room for improvements.

JamesC 焦國安

President Obama proposed a $4B budget for AV in early 2016.   Obama asked: “There are going to be a bunch of choices that you have to make, the classic problem being: If the car is driving, you can swerve to avoid hitting a pedestrian, but then you might hit a wall and kill yourself. It’s a moral decision, and who’s setting up those rules?”

Will the insurance company, the car company, or the programmer will make the decision on who and what to hit right before and accident is happening?  

There are quite a few issues (legislations, 5G network, who will make the calls under what conditions) need to be resolved in addition to technical requirements.

MF        

謝謝大家對自駕車發展議題的很多寶貴的意見,還需要大家持續給力惠示卓見。

個人的看法是,自駕車的發展仍然有很多亟待大家面對的觀念與課題。

當然,安全運營始終不能打折扣。而面對這些未來發展,我們應該做好那些準備工作?尤其,自駕車的運營在任何地方都有本土化的課題,在台灣該怎麼有策略的去迎接這個新的交通運輸環境的演化?

特斯拉的車子在台灣的高速公路肇事,是大家所不樂見的。這也點出在台灣L2+自駕車在高速公路運行,顯然還有大幅提升準備的空間。但這顯然也還不是台灣現在可以投入準備的「範疇」!

然而,台灣還是需要有自己準備去調和自駕車運營的商業模式,譬如說社區的第一哩或最後一哩公共運輸的自駕接駁,會不會是優先可以開始準備投入的?

或者是ART系統的導入?

我們必須接地氣,在地就事論事⋯⋯


 Autonomous Vehicle Technology in Taiwan

 Autonomous Vehicle Technology

 Autonomous Vehicle Technology in US

Chat history in "ICTPA國際華人交通運輸協會"
6/6/2020

MF     台灣的交通部很想積極推動自駕車的產業與服務,各位先進認為最應該優先關注那些課題呢?敬請惠示卓見!謝謝!

陳瑞麟 Reh-Lin N. Chen    跟據我個人這一兩年參舆的相關討論和對台北大都會區的瞭解,我個人的愚見是自駕車的交通安全可靠度要提高,另外可加強 Connected Vehicles 的研發,讓自駕車和人駕車都可以和自動電腦號制聯結,造成省油、節速又安全的車流。路邊停車和公私停車場的技術及安全配合也是必需。另外在監理、即時交通事故處理和保險理賠,也要探討配合。我有空再找一些其它我可能忘記的要點。請吳先生和大家先指正,也共同探討。

Jimmy Lin       我公司最新在台灣完成的一項工程短片和諸位分享。CTC設計監造高雄鼎金系統交流道匝道改善工程,施工法難度很高
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dUfPjOiiYGtnwtLpDFf8pkenI8mhdZ0r/view?usp=sharing

陳瑞麟 Reh-Lin N. Chen   個人的愚見,認爲 Autonomous Vehicles 的科技遲早會在美國、歐州甚至亞州盛行,只是時間及發展進度問題。使用道路的老百姓像Alice及我輩非專家,也是政府推動此科技上路時,最需要做推廣及再教育的對像,所以大家的意見也是很重要的。

Joel 和各位先進:中華工程顧問公司吳董事長盟分日前才提問此問題:“台灣的交通部也很想積極推動自駕車的產業與服務,各位先進認為最應該優先關注那些課題呢?

瑞麟有幸參舆2019年10月2日,在南舊金山灣區的世界自動車安全性的高峯會議。會議名稱、内容及參考資訊如下: World Safety Summit On Autonomous Technology https://velodynelidar.com/safety-summit/

當天的一則新聞報導有此標題World Safety Summit On Self Driving Car Tech Kicks Off At Levi’s Stadium, 詳細新聞報導可進此網站閲讀全文。

https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2019/10/02/world-safety-summit-on-self-driving-car-tech-kicks-off-at-levis-stadium/

但我把重點提出給大家參考:

1.各個廠商都在競技,但是瞭解大家仍需要合作才更有力量和成效。
2. 自動車的車速和安全自動控制是要最先要處理的前題。如果不安全超速的無人車要上路,政府、業者和使用者絶無接受無人車的可行性。

Anand Gopalan, Velodyne Lidar’s Chief Technology Officer, noted the collegial atmosphere among competitors in these early days of development.

“I think people learned that going fast was really challenging,” said Gopalan. “I think now that’s been tempered by reality where people realize if you’re driving really fast, you have to make some very challenging decisions very quickly. So you are now seeing start with more modest expectations, where they want to make this technology work at 30, 35, 40 mph…And then tackle the problem of speed.”


Click here to see ICTPA Group Conversation History on LINE

6/9/2020

You are invited to join our ICTPA group discussions regarding AVT , join our group chat (ID: ictpagroup1) on "LINE".